'12 IL C Michael Samuels (LOI)

[Jason Svoboda]

Center
Mount Carmel (IL) Wabash Valley C.C.

Ht: 6-foot-11
Wt: 250 lbs

[Jason Svoboda]

Posted on Twitter that he committed to Indiana State.

http://twitter.com/#!/ByAnyMeanz_50

[bent20]

A replacement for Walker?

[bigsportsfan]

A replacement for Walker?

Maybe he can hit more than 3 for 10 from point blank range.

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Maybe he can hit more than 3 for 10 from point blank range.

Nice how soon you forget how well Walker played last year in St. Louis to take us back to the NCAA tourney. I realize that expectations have risen (as they should) but lets be real - you have no idea what you're talking about. If you can't see (by now) that Myles Walker brings a hell of a lot more to this team than 3 of 10 shooting.

[SycamoreFan317]

Maybe he can hit more than 3 for 10 from point blank range.

What no mention of his 14 rebounds and no mention of his improved FT shooting. Anybody can find the negatives try being positive and build people up the negative BS around here is really getting to be stupid.

[SycamoreStateofMind]

What no mention of his 14 rebounds and no mention of his improved FT shooting. Anybody can find the negatives try being positive and build people up the negative BS around here is really getting to be stupid.

Also worth noting that 7 of those rebounds were offensive - very nice effort on the boards tonight! Not to high jack this thread totally - but when officials let Walker bang inside then he can rebound like this, usually he is not allowed to beat and bang like this.

[long gone]

Maybe he can hit more than 3 for 10 from point blank range.

Can you?

[ISU_TREE_FAN]

Was he at the game last night?

[SycamoreBlue3209]

Yeah, he was sitting down in the end zone by our bench last night.

[pbutler218]

So..... is this guy any good? Where's the official word on him,stats,history,etc?

[SycamoreFan317]

So..... is this guy any good? Where's the official word on him,stats,history,etc?

We need to trust the coaches, they obviously see something in him.

http://www.njcaa.org/colleges_college_player.cfm?sid=4&collegeid=1585&category=Roster&slid=2&teamid=122720&athleteid=348257

[bluestreak]

here is some video when he played at VU - #33

[Bluesier]

here is some video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cj773M-6Nm8)when he played at VU - #33

Pretty sure that is not him.

[long gone]

Not as fast or as strong as Walker (does not appear to be better than Walker) but taller and maybe more jumping ability.????

[True Blue]

That does not look like him to me.

[jlandrus23]

That video is not of Samuels. That #33 is DeShawn Delaney, he plays at VU this year and is a freshman. That video is from our Olney Central game earlier this year, so yeah that is not Michael Samuels.

[Bluesier]

For Olney, #5 is Thomas Anderson and #22 is John Michael Jarvis.

[BrokerZ]

We need to trust the coaches, they obviously see something in him.

http://www.njcaa.org/colleges_college_player.cfm?sid=4&collegeid=1585&category=Roster&slid=2&teamid=122720&athleteid=348257

I trust our coaches and their eye for talent, but I'm assuming the "something" they see right now is someone who's 6-foot-11 and 250 lbs. You can't teach that. Someone that size surely can develop a nice hook shot and is good for a few put-backs. We'll be lacking that kind of size next year, so I like the pick-up even if he's not a prolific post scorer or monster rebounder.

[bluestreak]

Sorry guys...shoulda checked closer.

[bigsportsfan]

That video is not of Samuels. That #33 is DeShawn Delaney, he plays at VU this year and is a freshman. That video is from our Olney Central game earlier this year, so yeah that is not Michael Samuels.

Let's get him. He's a beast.

[skdent1414]

Before we get all worked up about the new big man, I did a little research. Not to burst anyone's bubble but these are the stat lines for our last 6 players listed 6-10 or above. Needless to say, ISU is cursed when it comes to big men. Hopefully this one will pan out. I did not include Jake Kitchell because he is only a freshman.

6-11 Josh Crawford(08’-10’) 3.9 ppg 2.8 rpg
6-10 Brant Leitnaker (06’-10) 2.8 ppg 1.7 rpg
6-10 Mick Yelovich (04’-08’) 3.0 ppg 1.6 rpg
6-10 Ted Morris (02’-04’) 3.7 ppg 2.2 rpg
6-10 Michael Kernan (01’-03’) 3.2 ppg 1.0 rpg
6-11 Josh Hallatt (93’-95’) 2.8 ppg 2.0 rpg

These stats are of their best year. Sorry if I missed a player.

[ISU_TREE_FAN]

Before we get all worked up about the new big man, I did a little research. Not to burst anyone's bubble but these are the stat lines for our last 6 players listed 6-10 or above. Needless to say, ISU is cursed when it comes to big men. Hopefully this one will pan out. I did not include Jake Kitchell because he is only a freshman.

6-11 Josh Crawford(08’-10’) 3.9 ppg 2.8 rpg
6-10 Brant Leitnaker (06’-10) 2.8 ppg 1.7 rpg
6-10 Mick Yelovich (04’-08’) 3.0 ppg 1.6 rpg
6-10 Ted Morris (02’-04’) 3.7 ppg 2.2 rpg
6-10 Michael Kernan (01’-03’) 3.2 ppg 1.0 rpg
6-11 Josh Hallatt (93’-95’) 2.8 ppg 2.0 rpg

These stats are of their best year. Sorry if I missed a player.

Knew we had not done too well but didn't realize it was this bad? Wow, what a waste. Have always said a good 6'8 player will serve well in the Valley. That Carl Hall guy for Wichita is a 6'8 JC transfer and in several other games this year been a rebounding machine. Give me a 6'8 frontline anytime.

[bent20]

Before we get all worked up about the new big man, I did a little research. Not to burst anyone's bubble but these are the stat lines for our last 6 players listed 6-10 or above. Needless to say, ISU is cursed when it comes to big men. Hopefully this one will pan out. I did not include Jake Kitchell because he is only a freshman.

6-11 Josh Crawford(08’-10’) 3.9 ppg 2.8 rpg
6-10 Brant Leitnaker (06’-10) 2.8 ppg 1.7 rpg
6-10 Mick Yelovich (04’-08’) 3.0 ppg 1.6 rpg
6-10 Ted Morris (02’-04’) 3.7 ppg 2.2 rpg
6-10 Michael Kernan (01’-03’) 3.2 ppg 1.0 rpg
6-11 Josh Hallatt (93’-95’) 2.8 ppg 2.0 rpg

These stats are of their best year. Sorry if I missed a player.

Did you leave Jay Tunnell out because isn't 6'10" plus? Walker is arguably the best big man we've had in quite a while. People down on him would be wise to look at this list. There is no question though that size (and I'm not just talking height) helps. We need some big bodies (some muscle) to fight for boards and make the other team's big men work. Kitchell and Gant, and Mahurin for that matter, for as great as they can be they are more like a Tunnell. They're not going to bang around much inside, not as consistently anyway.

[Eleven]

Before we get all worked up about the new big man, I did a little research. Not to burst anyone's bubble but these are the stat lines for our last 6 players listed 6-10 or above. Needless to say, ISU is cursed when it comes to big men. Hopefully this one will pan out. I did not include Jake Kitchell because he is only a freshman.

6-11 Josh Crawford(08’-10’) 3.9 ppg 2.8 rpg
6-10 Brant Leitnaker (06’-10) 2.8 ppg 1.7 rpg
6-10 Mick Yelovich (04’-08’) 3.0 ppg 1.6 rpg
6-10 Ted Morris (02’-04’) 3.7 ppg 2.2 rpg
6-10 Michael Kernan (01’-03’) 3.2 ppg 1.0 rpg
6-11 Josh Hallatt (93’-95’) 2.8 ppg 2.0 rpg

These stats are of their best year. Sorry if I missed a player.

Kante? (6-8) Avery? (6-9) Tunnel? (6-8)
Of the guys listed there, the only ones I would say were over 240 are.. Mick and Ted...

[hans1950]

I did find stats for this season.15 games,6ppg,4+rebounds,1 block.I realize JC ball is sometimes run and gun but this doesn't sound like a dominant player at least at this point.I'm sur the coaches see potential.we'll see.

[SycamoreFan317]

I did find stats for this season.15 games,6ppg,4+rebounds,1 block.I realize JC ball is sometimes run and gun but this doesn't sound like a dominant player at least at this point.I'm sur the coaches see potential.we'll see.

Posted this back on page 2, sorry you missed it.

http://www.njcaa.org/colleges_college_player.cfm?sid=4&collegeid=1585&category=Roster&slid=2&teamid=122720&athleteid=348257

[nwi stater]

How about, for you members of the OFC, De Carsta Webster, and everyones favorite tax driver, and sticky fingers, Richard Johnson from the 70's

[Indians1]

"Big Mike" Samuels plays for Dan Sparks, the Uncle of Chelsea Buher. She spoke with him about Indiana State. He has made huge strides this year after leaving Vincennes University. He still has work to do, but is eager to get better. He is huge! Runs the floor well and has pretty good hands. Coach Sparks and Coach Eric Murphy feel he will do better in D1 next year because he will be playing against more kids his size and quickness..

[Gotta Hav]

How about, for you members of the OFC, De Carsta Webster, and everyones favorite tax driver, and sticky fingers, Richard Johnson from the 70's

Well, DeCarsta did become the All Time shot blocker for Indiana State, while Richard Johnson was by silent ballot, selected to the Nimrod First Team All Stars.

If there was ever a knucklehead that played athletics at ISU, the poster child is Richard Johnson

Besides being African American, wasn't he 7' and 260 pounds, and not very attractive looking?

As if after robbing a Drug store in Terre Haute, IN you're going to disappear with all of that going for you, or in Johnsons case, against you.

[IndyTreeFan]

"Big Mike" Samuels plays for Dan Sparks, the Uncle of Chelsea Buher. She spoke with him about Indiana State. He has made huge strides this year after leaving Vincennes University. He still has work to do, but is eager to get better. He is huge! Runs the floor well and has pretty good hands. Coach Sparks and Coach Eric Murphy feel he will do better in D1 next year because he will be playing against more kids his size and quickness..

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!! I was beginning to think that this guy was locked up in Fort Knox, with all the gold (that doesn't exist!) - he's the best kept secret in basketball! It's great to hear some info on him. Bodies like his don't come around that often, and I'm glad we've got him coming to ISU!!!

Any more specifics that you can provide would be great. What are his strengths/weaknesses, and what is his upside? Is he gonna be able to help plug up the middle like Myles? Sorry to badger with questions, but no one seemed to know anything about this kid. Thanks again for the info!!!

[hans1950]

His facebook page says he's from Brooklyn,NY.Went to high school out in the hills of Pennsylvania.

[Quabachi]

Posting this only cuz it shows a few other schools that were on his radar...

http://rivals.yahoo.com/temple/basketball/recruiting/player-Mike-Samuels-129429

Illinois State
Temple
Georgia State

[nwi stater]

Well, DeCarsta did become the All Time shot blocker for Indiana State, while Richard Johnson was by silent ballot, selected to the Nimrod First Team All Stars.

If there was ever a knucklehead that played athletics at ISU, the poster child is Richard Johnson

Besides being African American, wasn't he 7' and 260 pounds, and not very attractive looking?

As if after robbing a Drug store in Terre Haute, IN you're going to disappear with all of that going for you, or in Johnsons case, against you.

What I remember, back in the day, that johnson was a giant, much more than 260 and was caught robbing a dorm room of all things a sword??? He wasn't too hard to describe by the one who saw him take it.

[BankShot]

Since we're hashing OFC late 70's rumors...I heard that Johnson was charged w/ armed robbery of the old K-Mart out on east Wabash Ave (enroute to Memorial Stadium). Given the mentality of the crime, it sounds most accurate.

[IndyTreeFan]

Not to drag this thread even further away from Big Mike Samuels, my family was on vacation in Michigan in the early-mid 80's, and we were reading the Detroit Free Press sports section. They had a listing of players invited to a tryout for the Pistons and, lo and behold, who was on the list but our very own Richard Johnson. Got a good laugh...

[ISU_TREE_FAN]

How about, for you members of the OFC, De Carsta Webster, and everyones favorite tax driver, and sticky fingers, Richard Johnson from the 70's

Ask Purdue's Joe Barry Carroll what he thought of Richard Johnson?........................he was intimidated, absolutely intimidated in the game in Terre Haute. I remember Johnson squaring up defensively on Johnson and giving him a look like "I'm gonna kill you" and old JB Carroll shrank like a violet and was never in that game.

[Indians1]

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!! I was beginning to think that this guy was locked up in Fort Knox, with all the gold (that doesn't exist!) - he's the best kept secret in basketball! It's great to hear some info on him. Bodies like his don't come around that often, and I'm glad we've got him coming to ISU!!!

Any more specifics that you can provide would be great. What are his strengths/weaknesses, and what is his upside? Is he gonna be able to help plug up the middle like Myles? Sorry to badger with questions, but no one seemed to know anything about this kid. Thanks again for the info!!!

Mike has decent footwork and an attitude, lol. Not always a bad attitude, he just wants to do well all the time and wants to win. Like I said, he has made HUGE strides since the beginning of the year and if Coach Sparks would have had him last year, wow , look out. He is probably the most improved on a loaded team for Wabash Valley. They currently have Baylor, Kentucky and several other top 10 schools looking at different players on this team. Cincinnati was hot after Mike and were mad that he verballed and didn't take a visit to see the Bearcats.

He is still green in some areas, but Coach Lansing will work on improving those aspects. Is he a superstar, no, but he will contribute and does have a wide body. I will get some pics this weekend and let you know how he does as well.

[Indians1]

Good things would include a nice jump hook and he does decent at rebounding. I have yet to see him play defense on someone his size, but if they make the NJCAA National T'ment, he will get a taste of that. He does get out and sprint down the floor, which for someone his size you don''t always see.

Downside is he has a sideway spin on his shot, which Coach has worked tirelessly to get him to change. He just needs to hit the gym and work on it as at times his shot spins out of the rim. Probably why he has developed the jump hook as it doesn't involve his guide hand, which is causing the sideways rotation.

Is he ready for the MVC, not as of January 2012, but if he continues to work, yes he can help the Sycamores.

[SycfromBirth]

How many years of eligibility will Mike have? Boda has him listed as a Freshman next year, can that be right, considering that he is coming out of a CC?

[Jason Svoboda]

How many years of eligibility will Mike have? Boda has him listed as a Freshman next year, can that be right, considering that he is coming out of a CC?

No, that was my error. He should have 2 I believe.

[Indians1]

He will have 2 years at ISU, but he needs to get with it on the court. Ever since he verballed he has done NOTHING! Is not even starting now.

[IndyTreeFan]

He will have 2 years at ISU, but he needs to get with it on the court. Ever since he verballed he has done NOTHING! Is not even starting now.

Oh boy...:eek7:

[sycamorebacker]

Well, we don't have to sign him. Sounds like we should move on.

[pbutler218]

Oh great..... another big man stiff!!! I recommend pulling his offer NOW!! If he can't start @ a Juco as big as he is then it doesn't sound like he's a D-1 player.

[Quabachi]

Yeah, all of you guys have more insight into this player than Greg Lansing.

[IndyTreeFan]

Actually, Indians1 just might, since he's related to the kid's coach...

And it doesn't bother you at all that a guy we're giving a scholarship isn't even a starter on his JC team anymore? I don't think you have to be a basketball coach to be perturbed by that. If Greg feels like he's still our guy, then I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but to have the discussion only makes sense.

Mike, come on dude, don't throw your chance away!!! We need you!

[Quabachi]

Actually, Indians1 just might, since he's related to the kid's coach...



Fair enough.

[Quabachi]

Mike, come on dude, don't throw your chance away!!! We need you!

And I think this is much more constructive than "Don't sign him".

I agree, step it up Mike, Champions are made in the off-season....or in your case, pre-D1. You can do it!

[Indians1]

And I think this is much more constructive than "Don't sign him".

I agree, step it up Mike, Champions are made in the off-season....or in your case, pre-D1. You can do it!

I agree. He can still be a great player for ISU, and this happens sometimes with kids who know where they are going before their season finishes. But it is so frustrating to see him do this. So much talent and size, he should be ruling the GRAC Conference. Coach Sparks has some serious talent on this team with the kids getting looks from all over the MVC to Kentuckty, Baylor, Oregon, etc..... so it is easy for him to get bumped on playing time when the effort is not there. I like Mike, a lot, nice young man. He just needs to finish his committment to Wabash Valley and help lead them to the NJCAA Finals in a month.....as he wouldn't be going to ISU without Coach Sparks improving him so much this season.

Will keep you all updated!

[pbutler218]

Agreed......let's give the guy a chance. Maybe our luck with a true big man will improve!

[BankShot]

Funny thing about MOTIVATION in some people...we've seen the same thing happen over the years to a few HS starz that commit early, then stumble upon the manana concept and treat their final yr. as a siesta celebration.. Some pull out of it, some don't.

If ISU had a renowned "post man" coach in touch with Samuels NOW, I'd guarantee he'd be picking his act up @ WVJC...or else.

[Sycamore Proud]

Funny thing about MOTIVATION in some people...we've seen the same thing happen over the years to a few HS starz that commit early, then stumble upon the manana concept and treat their final yr. as a siesta celebration.. Some pull out of it, some don't.

If ISU had a renowned "post man" coach in touch with Samuels NOW, I'd guarantee he'd be picking his act up @ WVJC...or else.

Right you are.

[Jason Svoboda]

http://www.njcaa.org/colleges_college_player.cfm?sid=4&collegeid=1585&category=Roster&slid=2&teamid=122720&athleteid=348257

Averaging 4.6 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 0.3 apg, 0.1 spg and 0.7 bpg. Shooting 56% (20-36) from the line and 45% from the floor, 22 of 41. Anyone got anything new on him... doesn't look he has played well in over a month.

[IndyTreeFan]

Eeek! :eek7:

[bigsportsfan]

http://www.njcaa.org/colleges_college_player.cfm?sid=4&collegeid=1585&category=Roster&slid=2&teamid=122720&athleteid=348257

Averaging 4.6 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 0.3 apg, 0.1 spg and 0.7 bpg. Shooting 56% (20-36) from the line and 45% from the floor, 22 of 41. Anyone got anything new on him... doesn't look he has played well in over a month.

What the hell do we want this guy for?

[Kneepad]

Wichita State gets a juco like Hall, who is a difference maker. We get a guy who averages less than 5 and 5 even though he's twice the size of everyone else. Do we really need another project?

The coaches must see something, but the stats sure aren't bearing it out...

[Lights Out]

The only reason that ISU is on to this kid is because Coach Ragland recruited him to Vincennes University two years ago. When Coach Ragland left VU and came to ISU, Samuels transferred to Wabash Valley. From the stuff I have heard this is a kid with tremendous upside, but he has had some questions brought about his work ethic. I am not bashing the kid, but I have heard from many sources that this is the main reason he left VU. He is definitely a project, and hopefully he works out!

[Southgrad07]

The only reason that ISU is on to this kid is because Coach Ragland recruited him to Vincennes University two years ago. When Coach Ragland left VU and came to ISU, Samuels transferred to Wabash Valley. From the stuff I have heard this is a kid with tremendous upside, but he has had some questions brought about his work ethic. I am not bashing the kid, but I have heard from many sources that this is the main reason he left VU. He is definitely a project, and hopefully he works out!

Im not a big fan of projects, especially when we only get him for 2 years. Gotta trust that coach Lansing and Ragland can get him to realize his potential though.

[SycfromBirth]

Is it possible that he could walk on? I don't mind having a player with good upside, but, based on what others are saying about his current performance, I have a hard time thinking that he would compete for 5 minutes a game by his senior year.

Are we outside the signing period, or, is it possible that he is sitting on "verbal" status as the coaching staff waits for a decision on a higher priority recruit?

[Jason Svoboda]

Had a bucket in a win on the 18th.

http://tristate-media.com/drr/sports/local_sports/article_f2c021a2-5bdb-11e1-9a90-0019bb2963f4.html

[ISU_TREE_FAN]

Need to have some faith in what the coaches see but man this is a loooooooooooooooooooongshot.

[BankShot]

Ya, our coaches have sure set a benchmark for developing big men, haven't they?

[Jason Svoboda]

Team won 93-84 on Wednesday but he wasn't listed as having scored.

http://www.tristate-media.com/drr/sports/local_sports/article_283d8f8a-5e3a-11e1-8295-001871e3ce6c.html

[bent20]

Wiggins seems to be a scorer. He dominates most of their game stories.

[Jason Svoboda]

Wiggins seems to be a scorer. He dominates most of their game stories.

Yeah, we were after him at one point I believe, too. He was listed as having an offer on Rivals and visited when he was at VU.

http://www.sycamorepride.com/showthread.php?t=7967

[Southgrad07]

like someone said any chance he is just a walk on? I know he is big but im sorry stat lines of 2 points and 0 points arent very encouraging. I know its not all about how many points you score but I dont think he is really racking up a ton of boards or blocks either

[pbutler218]

What the heck is he.....a big stiff! Can't our recruiters do any better?!!

[Dgreenwell3]

any chance either A. He's a Walk on or B. his playing time has been affected by his commitment?

[Jason Svoboda]

Team won Saturday 76-66 but he wasn't mentioned in the article.

http://tristate-media.com/drr/sports/local_sports/article_a1d7efd8-6160-11e1-bbf0-001871e3ce6c.html

Looking at the NJCAA page and he had goose eggs on his stat line so he may not have even played?

http://www.njcaa.org/colleges_college_player_game_by_game.cfm?sid=4&collegeid=1585&category=Roster&slid=2&teamid=122720&athleteid=348257

[IndyTreeFan]

Oh Lord. This could be bad...

[pbutler218]

What could the coaches have possibly seen in this guy considering he doesn't even play much........................... other than he's a big guy? I just DON'T get it!!!!!

[Jason Svoboda]

Team won by a bucket last night, 67-65. Not listed in the story at all. I'm going to assume he didn't play again.

http://tristate-media.com/drr/sports/local_sports/article_9b91eeec-63ba-11e1-8473-0019bb2963f4.html

[Kneepad]

If this kid still sucks down a scholarship at ISU, the staff should be ashamed of themselves. I can't believe that this is the best we could do. A juco who can't even see the court AT HIS JUCO? And it's not like we have anyone who can coach him up.

[sycamorebacker]

And it's not like we have anyone who can coach him up.

Nonsense. Phooey. It isn't rocket science and they have done a fine job with Myles, RJ and Kitchell.

[BankShot]

Ya, Kitch & RJ really found their niche this past season...and Gant reflected every bit of his IN All-star billing.
This is the most outlandish thought you've ever honed here on the Forum. How many ISU "big men" gathered post-season MVC honors?

[Kneepad]

Yeah, our bigs have really torn it up this year...:krazy:

It's not from lack of talent, either. Our bigs are not as good this year as they were last year. We don't have a real big man coach...

[sycamorebacker]

You need to figure it out for yourselves.

You don't think Walker or RJ or Kitchell are better than they were in Nov of 2010? You are nuts.

[Bluethunder]

Nobody on the team improved more last year during he season than Walker, and I don't think anyone on the team improved more in the off season than RJ.

[sycamorebacker]

We didn't see Kitchell last year but I'd bet the ranch he has improved a lot. And Gant will keep getting better and will be a 12 and 6 guy for us.



I think DL should be complemented on how he completely changed the way he plays the game. You don't often see someone improve their decision-making that much in one year.
I like the way he is driving to his left into the lane and passing off. Last year, it was always an adventure when he put the ball on the floor.

[mohoops247]

I think DL should be complemented on how he completely changed the way he plays the game. You don't often see someone improve their decision-making that much in one year.
I like the way he is driving to his left into the lane and passing off. Last year, it was always an adventure when he put the ball on the floor.

Agreed. He played very well last night and made some very smart plays down the stretch. He shot when it was there and made the extra pass when it was there. He definitely has grown as an all-around player.

[Daveinth]

The problem I have is there is no time for a JUCO big man project we need guys ready to hit the floor out of the gate . Not JUCO Projects. we have a hard time developing them in 5 years .

[sycamorebacker]

right, and this guy sounds like he has no work ethic. can't use anyone unless they play 100%.
I'm concerned about Bell in that regard.

I wonder if we have a chance to get the guy from Richmond. He sounds like a good prospect.

[sycamorenation23]

ive seen him play he's great around the block but due to off the court (practice) issues he is not seeing the floor until he shapes up a little

[Daveinth]

JUCO practice problems does not make a quality D-1 player

[BankShot]

We didn't see Kitchell last year but I'd bet the ranch he has improved a lot. And Gant will keep getting better and will be a 12 and 6 guy for us.



I think DL should be complemented on how he completely changed the way he plays the game. You don't often see someone improve their decision-making that much in one year.
I like the way he is driving to his left into the lane and passing off. Last year, it was always an adventure when he put the ball on the floor.

Ya, he really pressured Wichita State on Friday...bottom line, DL's consistency graph remained virtually the same this season

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

[BankShot]

We didn't see Kitchell last year but I'd bet the ranch he has improved a lot. And Gant will keep getting better and will be a 12 and 6 guy for us.



I think DL should be complemented on how he completely changed the way he plays the game. You don't often see someone improve their decision-making that much in one year.
I like the way he is driving to his left into the lane and passing off. Last year, it was always an adventure when he put the ball on the floor.

Ya, he really pressured Wichita State on Friday...

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

You wanna see how the MOTION OFFENSE plays with the ISU big men development? Take a glance @ the following Shox results:

RJ
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

Kitch
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

Gant
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

Walker
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

You can't put a square peg in a round hole...if Lansing doesn't change his offense, you'll see NO DIFFERENCE in player performance. Won't work.

[sycamorebacker]

Ya, he really pressured Wichita State on Friday...

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

You wanna see how the MOTION OFFENSE plays with the ISU big men development? Take a glance @ the following Shox results:

RJ
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

Kitch
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

Gant
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

Walker
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/gametracker/shotchart/NCAAB_20120302_INST@WICH

You can't put a square peg in a round hole...if Lansing doesn't change his offense, you'll see NO DIFFERENCE in player performance. Won't work.

Yes, you are right. Our offense relies too much on dribbling, passing and shooting. We need to play an offense where shooting and rebounding are not so important.

Regarding our bigs -- I see our all-stars play every summer and go to the top 40 and I follow the progress of the players like Fromm, Carroll, Andrew Smith, Zeller, and, of course, RJ, Gant and Kitchell. Our guys are doing just fine and about exactly what you would predict. They all have a bright future if they work hard and keep their head right.

[Bluethunder]

Using the stats from games against WSU is not a fair comparison. First off, they have Upperclass post players and we have one Senior and three Sophomores or Freshman. Second, we really only have two guys who go down and bang, RJ and Gant are not bangers, unlike the Shockers who all have guys who can post up and bang

Just don't think it is an apple to apple comparison. Also, as mentioned above, we are talking about a Sophomore and two freshman. Let's have this conversation again I two years and if the stats haven't improved, I will buy you a beer and say you were right.

[BankShot]

I used the Shox stats because they were a "representative sample" of the past MVC season. Simply put, the "motion offense" is a perimeter-oriented design which makes it virtually impossible to develop an INSIDE power game. Without massive design changes by Lansing, I see little difference in the output of Kitchel & Gant as Sycamores.

[sycamorebacker]

I used the Shox stats because they were a "representative sample" of the past MVC season. Simply put, the "motion offense" is a perimeter-oriented design which makes it virtually impossible to develop an INSIDE power game. Without massive design changes by Lansing, I see little difference in the output of Kitchel & Gant as Sycamores.

We get the ball into our center more than about any team I've seen this year! I don't understand your statement. An inside game is an integral part of a motion offense.

[Dgreenwell3]

We get the ball into our center more than about any team I've seen this year! I don't understand your statement. An inside game is an integral part of a motion offense.
There arent many possessions where our bigs didn't touch the ball this year...

[Jason Svoboda]

There arent many possessions where our bigs didn't touch the ball this year...

Bullshit.

[Dgreenwell3]

Bullshit.

Just saying, Myles has been called a "black hole", we do get our bigs quite a few touches, it's not like we bobby knight these guys. We need to get our pieces to work together better, I actually think our pick and roll game needs to come back, pick and pop for when RJ or even Gant is on the floor...

[Gotta Hav]

Yes, you are right. Our offense relies too much on dribbling, passing and shooting. We need to play an offense where shooting and rebounding are not so important.

Regarding our bigs -- I see our all-stars play every summer and go to the top 40 and I follow the progress of the players like Fromm, Carroll, Andrew Smith, Zeller, and, of course, RJ, Gant and Kitchell. Our guys are doing just fine and about exactly what you would predict. They all have a bright future if they work hard and keep their head right.

Yeah, that offense that we run is just a set up for BIGS to get offensive rebounds....as matter of fact, we should re-name our Motion Offense to the REBOUNDS-R-US OFFENSE!

And it's a given that RJ, Gant, and Kitchell will work hard and keep their heads right.....the question is, can they have a bright future in an offense that dribbles and passes from 15 - 19 ft for for 25 seconds of the 35 second shot clock...then hopes that someone can go off reservation in the last 8 - 10 seconds to create some offense.

And a big part that off-the-reservation play to create some offense is our Rodeo Playing Point Guard running with abandon towards the baseline and going out of bounds in mid air....looking for a pass back to those at 15 - 19 feet. Wow, that's an offense that Big Men can thrive and have Bright Future in!!!

Expect more of the same for the next two years......and yes, let's HOPE that I'm wrong.

[Gotta Hav]

We get the ball into our center more than about any team I've seen this year! I don't understand your statement. An inside game is an integral part of a motion offense.

I think what I saw was....the opposing teams let us get the ball to our center who has a selection of left and right handed shots, second only to Harry Morgans.

For you members-in-waiting to join the OFC, Harry Morgan was part of the famous Harry and Larry show. Harry could put on a show one time down the floor, then the next time, make you cringe and say WTF?

Which by the way, if Harry Morgan had not played basketball at ISU, the now commonly used phrase of WTF would have never made it into the American English lexicon. Thanks Harry!

[Dgreenwell3]

Yeah, that offense that we run is just a set up for BIGS to get offensive rebounds....as matter of fact, we should re-name our Motion Offense to the REBOUNDS-R-US OFFENSE!

And it's a given that RJ, Gant, and Kitchell will work hard and keep their heads right.....the question is, can they have a bright future in an offense that dribbles and passes from 15 - 19 ft for for 25 seconds of the 35 second shot clock...then hopes that someone can go off reservation in the last 8 - 10 seconds to create some offense.

And a big part that off-the-reservation play to create some offense is our Rodeo Playing Point Guard running with abandon towards the baseline and going out of bounds in mid air....looking for a pass back to those at 15 - 19 feet. Wow, that's an offense that Big Men can thrive and have Bright Future in!!!

Expect more of the same for the next two years......and yes, let's HOPE that I'm wrong.

If we want to create an offense where the big men get tons of rebounds call frank Vogel of the Indiana pacers...he has hand made an offense pretty much for the Tyler hansboroughs of the world to be monsters on the glass...

[IndyTreeFan]

Suffice it to sy that our offense rarely worked this season, whether it was because guys were standing around or guys couldn't shoot or guys didn't know what to do. I highly doubt that Lansing got what he wanted from the offense most of the time. Let's just hope that he can work the kinks out for next season to take better advantage of whatever our strengths turn out to be!

I still think back to his presser when he was hired when he talked about wanting to run a motion type system, but more up tempo like he had worked with with the Phoenix Suns. Maybe this next season, he'll have the horses he needs to go more that direction.

[SycamoreStateofMind]

We get the ball into our center more than about any team I've seen this year! I don't understand your statement. An inside game is an integral part of a motion offense.

Perhaps you should turn on this Creighton vs. Illinois State game if you want to watch 2 teams who feed the post and actually run an offensive from the post. Compared to these teams, we don't use our post players at all.

[Eleven]

As much as we don't care for him...Dougie is putting on a clinic right now..

[Bluethunder]

. Maybe this next season, he'll have the horses he needs to go more that direction.

I think this sums it up perfectly. We will be much more athletic next season and would not be surprised to see a much improved offense. However, if I am wrong and next year we still struggle to break 55 points in games, then I will start leaning towards the "i hate this offense" crowd.

[sycamorebacker]

Suffice it to sy that our offense rarely worked this season,
.

I don't know that our offense wasn't working. We were 9th in the conference in FG% and were one shot away from 3rd place. We did something right.

I think if we had made more shots we woul have been fine.

[sycamorebacker]

There arent many possessions where our bigs didn't touch the ball this year...

absolutely.

Walker and Kitchell had 259 shots, which does NOT include inside shots by Gant or RJ. DL led the team with 270 and CR had 264.

[long gone]

Gant, Kitchell, and RJ need to get more physical and become stronger. They are currently finesse type players and for them to compete in the MVC that has to change.

[BankShot]

How many other MVC squads were "one shot away" from a 3rd place finish? Don't let a number cloud reality.

[sycamorebacker]

How many other MVC squads were "one shot away" from a 3rd place finish? Don't let a number cloud reality.

Yes, it really concerns me that some of the other teams could have made one more shot. I think I'll do a study on it and chart the shots to find reality. I'll get back to you on the what the standings REALLY were in the real world of reality.

I'm worried that next year we might miss 2 shots. What we really need to do is make sure that we understand reality and know what really happens next year as we look back. We don't want to assume that the standings are really what they really are.

I checked the MVC sight and they don't report what really happened, but, sorry, I tried.

[Jason Svoboda]

Team lost 72-62 on the 5th. He wasn't mentioned in the game recap.

http://tristate-media.com/drr/sports/local_sports/article_b6203c1a-66de-11e1-a841-001871e3ce6c.html

[Jason Svoboda]

WVC won it's opening playoff round game 63-59. No mention of him in the recap. NJCAA website shows goose eggs again.

http://www.tristate-media.com/drr/sports/local_sports/article_bf13b1fe-6a02-11e1-af2f-0019bb2963f4.html

[Gotta Hav]

Here's something highlight photos of Samuels in the NJCAA's.

[Indians1]

Okay Sycamore fans, Big Mike Samuels is back. Tonight he helped to lead his team to the Region Championship with 12 points in the second half. He was a beast!!!!! Took a charge at a pivotal point in the game. If he plays like this at the National Tournament, the Warriors may make some serious noise. Coach Lansing was at the game and he has to be very pleased in Samuels play.

Mike also played well on Friday night in the semi-finals. I have a few pics and will try to post tomorrow. Couldn't be happier for this young man in getting back on track for both his future with the Sycamores and helping his current Wabash Valley Warriors.

[Jason Svoboda]

Okay Sycamore fans, Big Mike Samuels is back. Tonight he helped to lead his team to the Region Championship with 12 points in the second half. He was a beast!!!!! Took a charge at a pivotal point in the game. If he plays like this at the National Tournament, the Warriors may make some serious noise. Coach Lansing was at the game and he has to be very pleased in Samuels play.

Mike also played well on Friday night in the semi-finals. I have a few pics and will try to post tomorrow. Couldn't be happier for this young man in getting back on track for both his future with the Sycamores and helping his current Wabash Valley Warriors.

Can you clue us in on why he didn't play for such a long stretch? I know you've got connections.

[Indians1]

Can you clue us in on why he didn't play for such a long stretch? I know you've got connections.

Coaches decision.

Games are online for the NJCAA National Tournament. WVC doesn't play until 3/21. http://www.njcaabbtrny.org/home/homepage.htm

[Indians1]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v333/lbuher/IMG_7996.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v333/lbuher/IMG_7952.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v333/lbuher/IMG_8007.jpg

[IndyTreeFan]

Okay Sycamore fans, Big Mike Samuels is back. Tonight he helped to lead his team to the Region Championship with 12 points in the second half. He was a beast!!!!! Took a charge at a pivotal point in the game. If he plays like this at the National Tournament, the Warriors may make some serious noise. Coach Lansing was at the game and he has to be very pleased in Samuels play.

Mike also played well on Friday night in the semi-finals. I have a few pics and will try to post tomorrow. Couldn't be happier for this young man in getting back on track for both his future with the Sycamores and helping his current Wabash Valley Warriors.

This is GREAT news! Now, let's just hope he keeps it up, and we might be able to put the "month in exile" behind us!!!

[Jason Svoboda]

Michael Samuels (6'10", C, soph., Bushkill, Pa.): Samuels became the first player in this Wabash Valley CC class to commit to a Division I school when he committed to Indiana State in January. While only averaging 4.8 ppgr, Samuels has good size in the post.He also had interest from Georgia State, Temple and Illinois State.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1111608-ncaa-basketball-recruiting-who-to-watch-for-in-the-njcaa-national-championship/page/16

[Indians1]

Mike has played very well this week at the NJCAA National Tournament. The Warriors lost their first game by two but have since won the next two games. Today Mike stepped on another players foot and has a severe sprain in an ankle. Not sure of his status for tomorrow but we will really need him as the Warriors play for 7th place.

[BankShot]

Nothing like durability...looks like we've signed a true gamer. He's got his work cut out for him coming on the heels of Kernan & Leitnaker.

[Southgrad07]

This is a link to his last game where he got hurt. If you watch it only watch the first half because thats where most of his action is. He made some really nice offensive moves and hits the boards pretty well. His biggest weakness seemed to be court awareness. He would lose track of smaller players both on the offensive and defensive end. Also he picked up some dumb fouls that he needs to cut out if he wants to stay on the floor at the next level. You can see some potential there with nice post moves and being 6'11-250, but i'd say unless he improves a lot over the summer we wont see him playing a ton next season. However he is not as bad as some of the comments make him out to be. At the very least he is big body who can come in match up physically which we havent always been able to say about our centers.



http://www.ihigh.com/njcaatv/broadcast_212414.html?silverlight=1

[Dgreenwell3]

Nothing like durability...looks like we've signed a true gamer. He's got his work cut out for him coming on the heels of Kernan & Leitnaker.

You forgot Crawford lol...

[Eleven]

You forgot Crawford lol...

He and Martin are both still playing professionally....

[Indians1]

This is a link to his last game where he got hurt. If you watch it only watch the first half because thats where most of his action is. He made some really nice offensive moves and hits the boards pretty well. His biggest weakness seemed to be court awareness. He would lose track of smaller players both on the offensive and defensive end. Also he picked up some dumb fouls that he needs to cut out if he wants to stay on the floor at the next level. You can see some potential there with nice post moves and being 6'11-250, but i'd say unless he improves a lot over the summer we wont see him playing a ton next season. However he is not as bad as some of the comments make him out to be. At the very least he is big body who can come in match up physically which we havent always been able to say about our centers.



http://www.ihigh.com/njcaatv/broadcast_212414.html?silverlight=1

I believe he has pretty good court awareness. There were several times during the National Tournament when he was double teamed and he dumped it down to a slashing Nick Wiggins or kicked it out for an open 3.

[Southgrad07]

I believe he has pretty good court awareness. There were several times during the National Tournament when he was double teamed and he dumped it down to a slashing Nick Wiggins or kicked it out for an open 3.

maybe he does. I only watched the one game of his and had the ball knocked away because he did not see smaller defenders and also lost players getting back on transition D. Also players who tend to pick up a lot of fouls many times have poor court awareness and get caught in bad positions leading to fouls. Its hard to judge him off seeing one game but that was just my observation, ill take your word for it since you've seen him play far more often.

[BankShot]

You forgot Crawford lol...

Crawford rarely played low post...I actually liked that guy. He liked to rumble and typically picked up quick fouls, most of the "touch" variety. He could've avg-ed, 6-8 pts more/gm in a "shooter oriented" offense, which raises the following question:

How are ISU's "shooters" EVER gonna get the requisite shots necessary in Lansing's 1/2 court 24.5 sec "motion" (?) offense? We're lucky to get 50/gm, which doesn't spread too thick over the bark of the Trees.

[sycamorebacker]

How are ISU's "shooters" EVER gonna get the requisite shots necessary in Lansing's 1/2 court 24.5 sec "motion" (?) offense? We're lucky to get 50/gm, which doesn't spread too thick over the bark of the Trees.

apparently, not a problem. we were 11-1 this year when our opponents scored 63 or less.

[Dgreenwell3]

Crawford rarely played low post...I actually liked that guy. He liked to rumble and typically picked up quick fouls, most of the "touch" variety. He could've avg-ed, 6-8 pts more/gm in a "shooter oriented" offense, which raises the following question:

How are ISU's "shooters" EVER gonna get the requisite shots necessary in Lansing's 1/2 court 24.5 sec "motion" (?) offense? We're lucky to get 50/gm, which doesn't spread too thick over the bark of the Trees.

Crawford was one of the most puzzling guys I have ever seen play for the trees. He could go off one game and disappear completely the next (go off as in seem dominant, control the paint)...seemed to be a bit of a headcase too...I like Josh, he is a good guy, i just saw alot of potential that never was seen (like Lietnaker)

[BankShot]

apparently, not a problem. we were 11-1 this year when our opponents scored 63 or less.

So it sounds like you're saying when our opponets score MORE than 63 pts, we're shit outa luck? This is exactly WHY we need MORE SHOTS...and we'll never get 'em unless Lansing makes some drastic changes in his game "theory," which has been aimed at SHORTENING the game, not LENGTHENING.

[Bluethunder]

Crawford was one of the most puzzling guys I have ever seen play for the trees. He could go off one game and disappear completely the next (go off as in seem dominant, control the paint)...seemed to be a bit of a headcase too...I like Josh, he is a good guy, i just saw alot of potential that never was seen (like Lietnaker)

Have to disagree on the "potential" that Lietnaker had. Never once did I see what the coaches were looking at with him. Saw him in high school and it seemedlke it took him 8 seconds to drive from the top of the key to the basket. Was never mpressed with him in high school. Footwork and quickness just werent good enough for this level. Really werent even good enough for high school.

[sycamorebacker]

So it sounds like you're saying when our opponets score MORE than 63 pts, we're shit outa luck? This is exactly WHY we need MORE SHOTS...and we'll never get 'em unless Lansing makes some drastic changes in his game "theory," which has been aimed at SHORTENING the game, not LENGTHENING.

I think you accidently got something there. Why work for a good shot if you can't hit it.

It kind of like playing golf. If you have trouble with fairway woods, hit the ball into the trees to give yourself a better shot.

[BankShot]

We've touched upon the concept of a "good shot" in prior posts, and most agree that just because a player is unobstructed doesn't lay the foundation of a "good shot." Ever wonder WHY the success of a zone "D"? Sure, players will be wide open in selected areas (usually FARTHER away from the basket, where % becomes an ally of the "D"), but offensive timing & rhythm are also integral aspects of shooting and must be considered. When a team approaches 20+ sec while dancing around the perimeter, do you think the pressure INCREASES or DECREASES to sink a FG? How many players perform BETTER under such conditions?

Former Georgetown coach John Thompson, while providing commentary on the XM broadcast of the IU-KY NCAA game also cited the negative impact of the 3 pt line upon DRIBBLE PENETRATION in college ball, highlighting the fact that teams that rely on the 3 pt shot are generally not gonna draw as many fouls while forcing their opponet to go to the bench, thus challenging the team DEPTH issue. It all adds up.

A "good shot" takes on a number of issues...not just being "open" to pull the trigger.

[long gone]

Would like to see more getting the ball into the post for a shot, driving to the basket for a shot, and dishing for open 3's for shot rather than working the clock.

[sycamorebacker]

We've touched upon the concept of a "good shot" in prior posts, and most agree that just because a player is unobstructed doesn't lay the foundation of a "good shot." Ever wonder WHY the success of a zone "D"? Sure, players will be wide open in selected areas (usually FARTHER away from the basket, where % becomes an ally of the "D"), but offensive timing & rhythm are also integral aspects of shooting and must be considered. When a team approaches 20+ sec while dancing around the perimeter, do you think the pressure INCREASES or DECREASES to sink a FG? How many players perform BETTER under such conditions?

Former Georgetown coach John Thompson, while providing commentary on the XM broadcast of the IU-KY NCAA game also cited the negative impact of the 3 pt line upon DRIBBLE PENETRATION in college ball, highlighting the fact that teams that rely on the 3 pt shot are generally not gonna draw as many fouls while forcing their opponet to go to the bench, thus challenging the team DEPTH issue. It all adds up.

A "good shot" takes on a number of issues...not just being "open" to pull the trigger.

Don't make it too complicated. A good shot is one you can make at a percentage better than your team average.

I generally think the 3 has hurt basketball the way it is supposed to be played. That being said, the good teams can drive when the D is spread to defend the 3 which is good; and the good teams drive a lot.
The problem with the drive is that the officials do not know what a foul is, so the fouls drawn or committed are at the mercy of the way fouls are traditionally called, which are incorrect.
I hope next year we can have a balanced offense all over the floor. I think RJ, Gant and Kitchell will be better scorers inside and out than this year's bigs. We still have a question mark on our outside game, but it cannot be worse. I'm hoping that 2-3 of Brown or K Smith or Burnett or McWhorter or Odum can drive and shoot the pullup. Odum has GOT to hit some 3's to force the D out on him and maybe Steve will get improve his %.

[sycamorebacker]

Would like to see more getting the ball into the post for a shot, driving to the basket for a shot, and dishing for open 3's for shot rather than working the clock.

Absolutely. Maybe it all takes care of itself if we shoot better. Then the D is forced to help out and clear some driving and passing lanes. I think our 3 young bigs will be much more of a scoring threat inside or outside than CR DL, and MW were this year and the D will have to honor that.
Unfortunately, I think the other teams felt like they could leave those guys open.

[LoudNProud]

Will he be eligible to play for ISU next season? Or will he have to sit out?

[Jason Svoboda]

Will he be eligible to play for ISU next season? Or will he have to sit out?
Immediately eligible. He will be a junior and have 2 years of eligibility remaining.

[Whistlegoat]

Immediately eligible. He will be a junior and have 2 years of eligibility remaining.
Wow! Who needs me to certify kids' NCAA eligibility when we have message board members to do it for me! Amazing! Sorry, I couldn't resist throwing in a little humor there.

If he satisfies NCAA junior college transfer rules, he will be immediately eligible.

[ISU_TREE_FAN]

Welcome aboard new Sycamore "Big Mike" Samuels........................................... .

GO SYCAMORES!

[Sycamore Proud]

Welcome to the Sycamores family Mike!!

[SycamoreStateofMind]

Wow! Who needs me to certify kids' NCAA eligibility when we have message board members to do it for me! Amazing! Sorry, I couldn't resist throwing in a little humor there.

If he satisfies NCAA junior college transfer rules, he will be immediately eligible.

Not that I don't appreciate you injecting some humor around here :), however Joel this board is actually fairly well educated and informed bunch of people. With any message board you get a mixed bag. Regardless of what Indiana State officials think and believe about this site - you've got a well educated, well informed and die-hard bunch of fans here.

[Jason Svoboda]

Wow! Who needs me to certify kids' NCAA eligibility when we have message board members to do it for me! Amazing! Sorry, I couldn't resist throwing in a little humor there.

If he satisfies NCAA junior college transfer rules, he will be immediately eligible.

I would imagine you've already done all of that fun stuff if he was able to sign the NLI. :bigsmile:

[BrokerZ]

Despite all the discussion surrounding his stats, I have a good feeling about this guy. Like Lansing said the Trib Star interview, you just can't teach 6'11" and 265 lbs. I'm sure he needs some polish, but his size alone will help on the boards and help with protecting the rim. Dribble penetration while we were on defense last year was a problem, so hopefully having a near-seven footer patrolling the paint will help. Let's hope he knows how to use his size and can stay out of foul trouble.

I also agree with the article in that the JUCO game is more guard-oriented and a more fast-break style that isn't conducive to a 7-footer. He'll face enough size in the MVC to be a valuable asset.

Welcome to the Sycamore Family, Michael!

[Indians1]

In the Tribune Star article it makes reference to his playing time both during the season and the final game at the National Tournament. The response by Mike should show everyone how he has grown up during this season. He definitely helped the WVC advance in the tournament.

The reason he didn't play in the final game was that he stepped on someones foot during the prior game and severely rolled his ankle. He tried to go but just wasn't able. I saw him this past weekend at the Clash on the Wabash and he looked great.

Congrats to Mike....I wish you all the success at ISU!